modding HUGE Problem with Modding RDR2 That No One is Talking About

[Joedorsmods 0]

On 2/15/2024 at 2:24 PM, Jrw174 said:

Whats the name of the mod? I'm a programmer and can take a look. No promises though

Did you you manage to find a solution?

[Osoa 3]

Gonna reply to this to boost it. This needs attention

[HarryPinga 0]

Same problem here, actually, only with trains, but the same problem.

[JKL409 7]

https://www.nexusmods.com/reddeadredemption2/mods/3728

 

The author of this mod seems to be releasing some very substantial fixes to the game. I'm wondering if maybe we could try and get him on board perhaps... 

[poons 0]

bump

[BigPimpin 0]

On 3/15/2024 at 12:10 PM, Dagger323 said:

Forcing a train and passengers to spawn by buying a ticket to ride one is not the same as encountering trains with passengers and a guard spontaneously in the world. Try seeing if you can spot trains with passengers when you're NOT riding them. Also, as others have pointed out, the specific mods you're using and the resolution and graphical settings of your game will greatly impact how likely you are to experience this issue.

 

I was wrong, I have began to notice less NPC's specifically and some wildlife not spawning, it seems the person who commented about YTD's was correct. I have fully removed all modded clothing and all spawns are perfect. Flamingos spawning, overall more people in towns, people spawning in trolley cars, and trains in the wild having a good amount of passengers in each car. It seems, at least for me, that modded clothing is the culprit.

 

[mashih 0]

On 3/29/2024 at 1:06 AM, JKL409 said:

https://www.nexusmods.com/reddeadredemption2/mods/3728

 

The author of this mod seems to be releasing some very substantial fixes to the game. I'm wondering if maybe we could try and get him on board perhaps... 

 

Good find i have been noticing this issues alot. I hope we can somehow get him to fix more of these annoying issues!

[Gumb012 2]

Just replying here to be another person to confirm that this is happening in their game. It's late so I haven't tested extensively, but the trams in Saint Denis don't have any passengers. I booked a train and it only had one passenger per cart with no guards, and I don't remember seeing flamingos at all recently (I definitely did earlier in my playthrough, when I had no/far less mods installed). I'll probably test more later but it seems like I suffer from this. I play at 4k resolution, with mostly high/ultra settings and have a relatively large number of 4k texture mods and other mods mentioned like PED, WERO etc.

 

I'll probably just bite the bullet and keep playing with the mods, but man what a bummer now that it's been realised...PRAYING for a fix. I don't have any technical knowhow or experience to offer whatsoever unfortunately.

 

P.S. I came across this thread after seeing a comment on a nexus mod page referencing the issue. Someone replied that it's a "skill issue" and the author of this thread replied to that comment with more detail so I followed the link. I'd actually seen this thread pop up before on google when searching for mods but never clicked on it. I am just as amazed as everyone else that this isn't more widely addressed...

[BigPimpin 0]

On 4/3/2024 at 4:21 AM, Gumb012 said:

Just replying here to be another person to confirm that this is happening in their game. It's late so I haven't tested extensively, but the trams in Saint Denis don't have any passengers. I booked a train and it only had one passenger per cart with no guards, and I don't remember seeing flamingos at all recently (I definitely did earlier in my playthrough, when I had no/far less mods installed). I'll probably test more later but it seems like I suffer from this. I play at 4k resolution, with mostly high/ultra settings and have a relatively large number of 4k texture mods and other mods mentioned like PED, WERO etc.

 

I'll probably just bite the bullet and keep playing with the mods, but man what a bummer now that it's been realised...PRAYING for a fix. I don't have any technical knowhow or experience to offer whatsoever unfortunately.

 

P.S. I came across this thread after seeing a comment on a nexus mod page referencing the issue. Someone replied that it's a "skill issue" and the author of this thread replied to that comment with more detail so I followed the link. I'd actually seen this thread pop up before on google when searching for mods but never clicked on it. I am just as amazed as everyone else that this isn't more widely addressed...

if you change your clothing to regular vanilla clothing you will see the spawns come back. 

[DooMTer 0]

Thanks for this information. I knew there was something wrong with my game.
I did some tests to find out which particular mod destroys my world. 
The biggest problem seems to be the WhyEm DLC : Red Dead Offline. Classic Red Dead Offline it work without problems.
I deleted the upscale weapon textures and the enhanced vegetation textures.
After deleting this modification, the world works perfectly (tested for approx. 2h)
Current mods I play with : WhyEm's Particles
                           Visual_Redemption
                           VESTIGIA
                           Terrain Textures Overhaul
                           Seasons
                           Remove Screen Effects 1.4
                           red_dead_offline
                           LLRO V7.4
                           crime_law
                           Complete Horse Overhaul
                           Best_TAA_and_Visual_Effects
                           All_Shots_Cause_Bleedouts

                          +several scripts
I play with a resolution of 4k DLDSR + Quality DLSS, mostly max settings + 225 Peds GameConfig
I hope I helped. I wish you many full trains and animals.

 

[bluemoon 1]

11 hours ago, DooMTer said:

Thanks for this information. I knew there was something wrong with my game.
I did some tests to find out which particular mod destroys my world. 
The biggest problem seems to be the WhyEm DLC : Red Dead Offline. Classic Red Dead Offline it work without problems.
I deleted the upscale weapon textures and the enhanced vegetation textures.
After deleting this modification, the world works perfectly (tested for approx. 2h)
Current mods I play with : WhyEm's Particles
                           Visual_Redemption
                           VESTIGIA
                           Terrain Textures Overhaul
                           Seasons
                           Remove Screen Effects 1.4
                           red_dead_offline
                           LLRO V7.4
                           crime_law
                           Complete Horse Overhaul
                           Best_TAA_and_Visual_Effects
                           All_Shots_Cause_Bleedouts

                          +several scripts
I play with a resolution of 4k DLDSR + Quality DLSS, mostly max settings + 225 Peds GameConfig
I hope I helped. I wish you many full trains and animals.

 

do you know here to download a working dinput8.dll or version.dll

Edited April 6 by bluemoon

[Altairkingofboopynoses 0]

19 hours ago, DooMTer said:

Thanks for this information. I knew there was something wrong with my game.
I did some tests to find out which particular mod destroys my world. 
The biggest problem seems to be the WhyEm DLC : Red Dead Offline. Classic Red Dead Offline it work without problems.
I deleted the upscale weapon textures and the enhanced vegetation textures.
After deleting this modification, the world works perfectly (tested for approx. 2h)
Current mods I play with : WhyEm's Particles
                           Visual_Redemption
                           VESTIGIA
                           Terrain Textures Overhaul
                           Seasons
                           Remove Screen Effects 1.4
                           red_dead_offline
                           LLRO V7.4
                           crime_law
                           Complete Horse Overhaul
                           Best_TAA_and_Visual_Effects
                           All_Shots_Cause_Bleedouts

                          +several scripts
I play with a resolution of 4k DLDSR + Quality DLSS, mostly max settings + 225 Peds GameConfig
I hope I helped. I wish you many full trains and animals.

 

Since finding out about this issue I've changed from Version.dll to Online content unlocker and scripthooks dinput8 file and completely removed Whyem's and my stream, I've got a good 4-5GB of mods such as Munitions, hunting grounds, Needs, thirsty horse etc and since removing the stupid amount of YTD's I had in my stream folder and WhyEms (I removed Collyrium too, though IDK if it had any effect, did it just to be safe.) and in a 40 minute playthrough i've already came across 2 passenger trains and 2 supply trains out in free-roam, the passenger trains each have 4-5 passengers each carriage with the normal amount of guards. Birds spawn rate is immediately higher, haven't been able to test the beggers yet as I'm in chapter 3 and had to ignore the life out of them previously do not sure if they'll spawn again but everything else seems to be working great.

 

Looks like the culprit was the YTD files for me.

[Altairkingofboopynoses 0]

9 hours ago, bluemoon said:

do you know here to download a working dinput8.dll or version.dll

It's ScripthookRDR2 V2 on nexus, download just the mod loader file and use it alongside online content unlocker, helps with some of the bugs.

[bluemoon 1]

14 minutes ago, Altairkingofboopynoses said:

It's ScripthookRDR2 V2 on nexus, download just the mod loader file and use it alongside online content unlocker, helps with some of the bugs.

thank you , it works

[Gumb012 2]

The flamingos outside St Denis have been mentioned as an easy way to test rare animal spawns, as this can apparently still be an issue even when everything else seems to be fixed.

 

I haven't found any despite fixing everything else, but I'm also not seeing any reliable info on flamingos in rdr2 through Google...are there actually flamingos in the game or is it just the pink coloured spoonbills that look a bit like flamingos? I thought I remembered seeing flamingos earlier in my playthrough but I could be mistaken.

 

Also, are there any other rare animals that are recommended as a good way to test this aspect of spawning?

[Altairkingofboopynoses 0]

10 hours ago, Gumb012 said:

The flamingos outside St Denis have been mentioned as an easy way to test rare animal spawns, as this can apparently still be an issue even when everything else seems to be fixed.

 

I haven't found any despite fixing everything else, but I'm also not seeing any reliable info on flamingos in rdr2 through Google...are there actually flamingos in the game or is it just the pink coloured spoonbills that look a bit like flamingos? I thought I remembered seeing flamingos earlier in my playthrough but I could be mistaken.

 

Also, are there any other rare animals that are recommended as a good way to test this aspect of spawning?

Yeah it's the spoonbills. i'm not sure at all why people refer to them as flamingos.

[Gumb012 2]

34 minutes ago, Altairkingofboopynoses said:

Yeah it's the spoonbills. i'm not sure at all why people refer to them as flamingos.

Thanks for confirming. I was on a wild goose (flamingo) chase after all!

[MayonakaAme 5]

Made a little video comparison for anyone interested

RDR2 Modding || NPC / Ambience spawning issue

[CurtisG2000 0]

Yep, unfortunately, YTDs are the cause of the lack of spawns. I've removed all files that use it, and spawns are working perfectly now. Hopefully there's a fix for the YTDs issue, as John without any mods looks awful.

[JKL409 7]

On 4/8/2024 at 9:20 AM, MayonakaAme said:

Made a little video comparison for anyone interested

RDR2 Modding || NPC / Ambience spawning issue

Thanks for putting in the time to make this. I'm hoping more people are gonna take note now.

 

I think a great comparison would have been base RDR2 with all the settings cranked up vs with a DLC pack or 4k/2k texture mods.

 

I've actually tested this out by loading a save multiple times and testing out the differences. Some of it is hard to capture as obviously RDR2 is an ambient non-linear world and there are going to be changes even loading the same save, but there are definitely obvious differences in the spawning of rare animals and the spawning of ambient events when comparing base to modded.

 

 

[Lonewulv13 4]

A quote from OmdeHoek from Nexus who made a bunch of game fix mods:

 

"you would need a scripter to extend something memory related with an .asi"

 

An inch closer to resolving the issue.

 

They also confirmed that it is mostly due to the YTD files in the stream folder that  increase Arthur's/John's textures. I've removed the 4k coat and hat textures though I haven't tested it out in Saint Denis yet.

[kaozzz777 18]

Thank You for posting this.
I checked and confirm. Some scripts might cause this aswell because I had to go further then just deleting texture mods, so I decided to start from zero.
Also huge thanks for the V2 scripthook link, that also makes a difference.

You can use RampageTrainer to show the pool for Peds (animals count as peds too), Objects and Vehicles. You find it under "World". It shows clearly something is broken.
We talk about 100-150% more entities spawned, game is constantly updating the area around you when things work correctly. Peds and vehicle diversity is much bigger.

 

This certainly needs to be investigated.

For nowonly option I see is to check after every mod added if the pool is still working correctly. At first glance it sounds trivial, but once you take a look you see it basically breaks the open world and possibly other stuff, too.

[loukpapa 0]

If i peek a guess of why this happening mostly with wardrobe mods (brake ped and game even after complete uninstall so need a clean save to start over)
Reading post and think how online game world structure is no train cities almost abandoned peds are rare to find unless u are in mission free roam is a vast peddles world (R* have to answer bout that not the modders but who will ask them that after upload a mod into a game this brakes lol)
and what most online to offline mods are doin i believe that they carry with  em the no life structure of a server with 
It maybe a solution maybe a script to rewrite rules maybe not but i think till we find an answer fellow players above give some kind of solution what we can use and what we cannot
Just keep thread alive 

[Dagger323 32]

14 hours ago, loukpapa said:

If i peek a guess of why this happening mostly with wardrobe mods (brake ped and game even after complete uninstall so need a clean save to start over)
Reading post and think how online game world structure is no train cities almost abandoned peds are rare to find unless u are in mission free roam is a vast peddles world (R* have to answer bout that not the modders but who will ask them that after upload a mod into a game this brakes lol)
and what most online to offline mods are doin i believe that they carry with  em the no life structure of a server with 
It maybe a solution maybe a script to rewrite rules maybe not but i think till we find an answer fellow players above give some kind of solution what we can use and what we cannot
Just keep thread alive 

It's not specific to online content mods. ALL of the mods I was using at the time I first noticed this issue did not require version.dll nor Online Content Unlocker, and used absolutely no online assets, yet many of them still broke the spawns. Conversely, I have used many online content mods since and many of them did not affect the spawns at all.
 

It seems to have to do specifically with the number of textures the game engine is trying to load at the same time as spawning peds, trains and wildlife, and if that number is too high, then the game will cut back on spawns to prioritize the textures. Many upscaled texture mods cause this issue, but mods that simply utilize existing textures without upscaling them, and without increasing the number of textures at once or swapping them out for higher quality ones, do not.
 

After a lot more rigorous testing I have concluded that I have not actually had any issue with spawning while modding in custom horse models and coats, for example, because none of the ones I've seen or used cause any increase in texture quality or the number of textures rendering at once. The horse mods simply replace existing horse models with existing textures already in the game. So simply having mods using custom .ymt's or .ytd's in the "stream" folder is not inherently an issue unless those files have an increased texture quality from the vanilla textures.
 

This also explains why simply enabling a higher LOD scale, particularly setting it to 2 instead of the default 1 in the system.xml file or from downloading the "Increased Geometry Level of Detail" mod from NexusMods will immediately cause a decrease in spawns because the number of higher quality textures and assets being loaded further away from the camera is drastically increased.

Edited April 15 by Dagger323

[TheWrath 1]

Came here after being linked to on the Nexus site. I can confirm this bug with LML mods installed. Just removing 4K texture mods did not make any difference. Deleting my entire LML folder fixed it. I was able to quickly see people on the tram in St. Denis. Did not check for the roseate spoonbill spawn.  I do have why ems dlc installed is it possible that this is the culprit? It would be insane to uninstall my entire LML folder. Or has anyone found a work around?