Ped Damage Overhaul 2.0 BETA 7

This sounds godly! 

Edit: Really FUN! A man was pissed at me so I just walked around him until punchy time. A wagon then ran over his leg and he limped at me angrily so I had to put him down 🙂

One thing I noticed was a person could take 3 tomahawks to the chest and I found that a bit crazy. Love this! Pls keep making more!!!

Sounds good. How do I install it?

12 hours ago, AbjectLlama said:

This sounds godly! 

 

Edit: Really FUN! A man was pissed at me so I just walked around him until punchy time. A wagon then ran over his leg and he limped at me angrily so I had to put him down 🙂

One thing I noticed was a person could take 3 tomahawks to the chest and I found that a bit crazy. Love this! Pls keep making more!!!

I am already working on an update. A minute after I published the mod here, a guy wrote me and asked for permission to put the file on nexusmods, I agreed. Getting a lot of feedback there (less health for NPCs, lower rate of NPCs surviving fire, etc.).

The thing with weapons like tomahawks and dynamite arrows, etc. is that I have to address those special weapons separately in the code (which I havent done yet, because it takes some work, but I want to do it).

1 hour ago, Maryouma said:

Sounds good. How do I install it?

You have to download the Script Hook by Alexander Blade (http://www.dev-c.com/rdr2/scripthookrdr2/) and put the dll into your RDR 2 root folder, then you put this mod into your root folder.

9 hours ago, HughJanus said:

 

I am already working on an update. A minute after I published the mod here, a guy wrote me and asked for permission to put the file on nexusmods, I agreed. Getting a lot of feedback there (less health for NPCs, lower rate of NPCs surviving fire, etc.).

The best way might be to make it configurable via an ini file so that people can balance it the way they want.

2 hours ago, LMS said:

 

The best way might be to make it configurable via an ini file so that people can balance it the way they want.

I have looked into one ini sample code before I started with the mod, but it was so complicated to set up (with own classes and such) that I omitted it.

Do you have any simple sample code by any chance? (like not having to parse the text file but actually get the attributes by command)

This is very very exciting it sounds like the realism is improved, i just hope fist fights are more epic now hehe, i love seeing brawls and there faces get bloody and bruised etc

1 hour ago, HughJanus said:

I have looked into one ini sample code before I started with the mod, but it was so complicated to set up (with own classes and such) that I omitted it.

Do you have any simple sample code by any chance? (like not having to parse the text file but actually get the attributes by command)

If you would like to keep it as simple as possible, you can use the WinAPI GetPrivateProfileString/GetPrivateProfileInt functions to read from an ini file. You will still have to do the parsing for some types such as float, though.

Something I've used in the past is https://github.com/jtilly/inih which is header only, so easy to work with. It also includes conversions to most common types which should make your life easier.

43 minutes ago, LMS said:

 

If you would like to keep it as simple as possible, you can use the WinAPI GetPrivateProfileString/GetPrivateProfileInt functions to read from an ini file. You will still have to do the parsing for some types such as float, though.

 

Something I've used in the past is https://github.com/jtilly/inih which is header only, so easy to work with. It also includes conversions to most common types which should make your life easier.

Thank you, I will try that.

21 hours ago, HughJanus said:

 

 

You have to download the Script Hook by Alexander Blade (http://www.dev-c.com/rdr2/scripthookrdr2/) and put the dll into your RDR 2 root folder, then you put this mod into your root folder.

Thanks! I played with it for a few hours. I like it a lot actually, buy it needs some work IMO. I can't dismember NPC's with a shotgun point blank with this mod enabled. That's my only major issue with the mod so far.

I like how NPC's don't instantly die from a tomahawk throw but it should maybe trigger the bleeding state to make it more realistic?

Another bug I noticed is that sometimes burned NPC's keep flailing on the ground even after the fire is gone.

2 hours ago, Maryouma said:

 

Thanks! I played with it for a few hours. I like it a lot actually, buy it needs some work IMO. I can't dismember NPC's with a shotgun point blank with this mod enabled. That's my only major issue with the mod so far.

 

I like how NPC's don't instantly die from a tomahawk throw but it should maybe trigger the bleeding state to make it more realistic?

 

Another bug I noticed is that sometimes burned NPC's keep flailing on the ground even after the fire is gone.

Dismemberment only occurs on the death blow. Since I have upped the health of NPCs, the shotgun is no longer strong enough to take out an NPC with one body or limb shot - the killing blow should still dismember though.

I have not yet found a command to force dismemberment, but I would like to do that (unfortunately it doesnt seem possible yet).

In the next version I will lower the chance of NPCs surviving fires (which should also lower the chance of the flailing bug occuring).

I will also use special damage modifiers for certain weapons (like dynamite arrows or tomahawks) to make things more realistic - as it looks now, I will also include shotguns in this special handling.

1 hour ago, HughJanus said:

 

Dismemberment only occurs on the death blow. Since I have upped the health of NPCs, the shotgun is no longer strong enough to take out an NPC with one body or limb shot - the killing blow should still dismember though.

I have not yet found a command to force dismemberment, but I would like to do that (unfortunately it doesnt seem possible yet).

 

In the next version I will lower the chance of NPCs surviving fires (which should also lower the chance of the flailing bug occuring).

I will also use special damage modifiers for certain weapons (like dynamite arrows or tomahawks) to make things more realistic - as it looks now, I will also include shotguns in this special handling.

Is it possible to make it so that shotguns do more damage to compensate for the upped health of NPCs?

Thanks again for the incredible mod

1 hour ago, Maryouma said:

 

Is it possible to make it so that shotguns do more damage to compensate for the upped health of NPCs?

 

Thanks again for the incredible mod

Yes, I will adjust the weapon damage modifier according to the weapon the player is currently using.

Nice Work dude. There are some good real actions the peds do now. Thats great.

But is it possible that when you shoot the leg of a ped with a Shotgun or explosive ammo, that the leg get destroyed like usual but the ped life much longer and try too flee? Or have the ped to be dead that the dismember-animation can kicks in? Would be s***, but good modders should solve this with some stuff.
How about creating a real bloodpatch together?

Nice work and please add ini file to change activation key or change it to f8 please 🙂

Thank you for the appreciation.

I will try some more stuff on the weekend and hopefully get a new version out (with configurable ini - at least with the most important variables).

How about a feature that allows you to change the reload speed for all weapons for both the player and NPC's. I don’t know why the reload animations have to be so ridicilously fast in this game to the point that it's immersion breaking. If all weapons had a more realistic (maybe about 75% slower) reload time then it would add more of a skillgap to the game cause it would make you think twice before wasting shots. This would also push players to wait for the right moment to shoot or to move up on an enemy and it would make melee weapons more viable options. Just some idea's. please tell me what you think. Other than that, this mod is fucking awesome. 

Thank you very much for your work!
Is it possible to add here, the time setting when dead bodies (corpses) begin to disappear,and the ability to control the time of decomposition into bones?

After  patch v1.03, rockstar did something and the corpses of people no longer decompose and immediately disappear ( As soon as you turn away, 50 meters away from him.)
At the time of the game’s release  the corpses remained for a long time, even after the game was restarted again. So by the beginning of the second part I already saw the bones of my enemies.This did not work in the missions, and with large numbers of NPCs, and on roads (NPC paths).

I also agree about the reload speed ) 

Hey there! I love what you're trying to do with this mod. However, it doesn't seem to be working as intended in most cases. Enemies always get back up as soon as they fall over, so you can't knock the breath out of them (just like in vanilla), there seems to be no "wounded state" (they're either dead or not dead, unless there's an artery shot), the stumbling is very prone to glitches and doesn't feel realistic anyway, since an enemy shot in both legs shouldn't even be able to get back up.

All in all, the mod doesn't really offer a way to "cripple" your opponents unless you get an artery shot, which is already in vanilla. It only seems to make combat more difficult by forcing a headshot; unless you get one, enemies are pretty much made of steel and can take literally forty shots to the chest before even considering the possibility of dying.

So here's my suggestion: vanilla is actually quite generous with health already, depending on the weapon. It takes 4 to 5 shots to the chest with a revolver in order to kill an enemy. Rifles are more powerful than that, but their advantage should be range, not raw stopping power. Truth is, ANY bullet to the chest, from any weapon, should be a considerable hurdle to one's day. If the point is to make enemies react more realistically to damage, then different behaviours are required. You nailed it with the fire behaviour: enemies now remain alive for a realistic amount of time until the fire kills them, and even if they survive, they go into a permanent wounded state in which they're alive, conscious but incapacitated. So here's what I propose, and bear in mind I don't know if natives even allow for this, so I'm just spitballing:

01 - Apply that wounded state more often. It makes no sense for an enemy to take three bullets to the chest and keep fighting. They should either die or remain mortally wounded for minutes, regardless of whether they were shot with a rifle or a revolver.

02 - A shot in one leg warrants that stumbling mechanic (though it needs polish). A shot in both legs should lead to a permanent wounded state, since the enemy shouldn't be able to get back up with both legs crippled, and nor should they die from it. This may create problems with enemies spawning (since too many living enemies keeps new ones from coming in), but you'd have to non-fatally wound a LOT of enemies until that became a problem.

03 - A shot in the shooting hand should also lead to a wounded state: the enemy has no chance of firing back with a crippled hand (yeah, they could try their left, but I doubt the natives allows for that level of finesse). Better yet, they could simply run away. For some reason, this isn't possible with lawmen (they can't be fully disarmed), but it is with regular NPCs.

04 - It would be nice to have some variety for artery shots, since the behaviour always repeats itself: fall over, get up again, run away (for a very long time, with this mod), fall over again, die. In fact, this tends to happen more frequently with this mod. If there's any way to do this with natives, I would suggest sometimes enemies maintain their ragdoll behaviour right after an artery shot until they die. The ragdoll behaviour right after the shot is perhaps the most impressive in the game, but as soon as the enemy falls over, they go into the wounded running animation and there's no longer any ragdoll behaviour until they die. It would be nice if that didn't always happen. Arterial wounds aren't tipically a great incentive for running around.

05 - It makes perfect sense for shotguns, dynamite and other heavy weaponry to maintain their stopping power, so I suggest no changes there. As I said, fire is also great now. You seem to have nailed those.

All in all, I suggest not increasing enemy health (though the .ini could always keep that option); instead, add a greater variety of behaviours that reward strategic aiming. Being able to non-fatally wound an enemy rather than kill him is great for roleplay, since right now there's no way to do that. You either kill them or tie them up, or they'll never stop trying to murder you.

Hey all,

concerning all the new suggestions, I will have to check the natives for them (reload speed, decomposing) but they do make sense to me also, so I guess I'll do some research.

@fitfondue: You can set the thresholds for knocking down and disabled state, as well as the knockdown chance and stumble chance in the ini (it all works for me, you can test it by e.g. setting the knockdown threshold to 10 and the dying threshold to 499, so NPCs when under 499 health (which should be done by hitting them once) shouldnt be able to get up when you downed them). The "unpolished" stumbling is more or less a workaround until OpenIV gets updated >> as of now, I dont have the option to change the NPCs movement clipset to "limping" or something similar, because we dont know the clipsets yet. So what I did is apply a force to the NPC randomly (based on the ini chance) when any leg was hit and simultaneously set it to ragdoll for a short time, this creates the stumbling behavior.

As for more variety in artery shots >> since we dont know the movement clipsets, there is nothing I can do at this moment, unfortunately.

Concerning the hand shot >> while testing, I removed the weapon from the NPC when he got shot in the hand (which didnt work 100% of the time, because we dont know the name of all hand and finger bones yet), but this let the weapon disappear completely (not drop to the ground). I found no other option in the natives, so I cut that feature out. But yes, I would like such a feature too. For myself, I have a version where the lasso lets all NPC weapons of the NPC who got caught by the lasso, disappear. If you want, I can upload it for you.

Thanks for all the feedback and ideas! I really appreciate you having fun with this mod 🙂

Edit: did a quick search and found nothing concerning the decomposing or bodies being removed. I didnt find a native for reloading speed, but we can check if someone is reloading. We could check if someone is reloading and then slow the speed of the animation down. I have tried slowing the running animation down in the past, but had no luck. Does anyone here know how to use SET_ANIM_RATE?

@HughJanusThanks for the reply! So I just tried the settings you suggested (I had tinkered with them previously) and they actually just prevented enemies from ever being knocked down, because the Knockback Threshold you suggested is 10 and it takes forever for them to go from 500 health to 10. Knockback only works from the start if it's set to 499, with knockback chance being set high as well. I set it to 99, but knockbacks aren't happening as frequently as that value suggests they should.

As for DyingThreshold, it doesn't seem to have any effect regardless of what value it's set to. Be it 10 or 499, it never works. Those three values seem to be problematic, in fact. KnockbackThreshold does seem to actually work, but KnockbackChance doesn't really seem congruent with its values, and DyingThreshold does nothing. As I said, enemies always get back up instantly, even when their health is near zero. And yes, I've tried changing NPC's starting health, and tinkering with different combinations of values. Same result.

I also tried the mod without any other mods active, just Scripthook. I went back to a previous save to make sure a trainer hadn't screwed something up in the current save. Same problem. DyingThreshold really works on your end?

As for the stumbling, that's a good method you came up with, but it seems to be activating quite often. If you set it high, then NPCs seem to have force applied to them every few frames, resulting in glitchy movement. It seems like the effect can kick in at any time, so at high values it just kicks in all the time. The default value of 30 works fairly well, although perhaps the ragdoll time could last a bit longer.

As for all the trouble with natives, yeah, I figured there were plenty of unknown values holding back the more ambitious features. Thanks so much for working on this mod and making it available. 🙂

@fitfondue Thanks for making me aware, mate! You were totally right. I had a status check spelled incorrectly (C++ syntax). The new version is up for download already.

I hope I reach hinti21 from Nexus soon, so the version there can be updated as well.

Hi @HughJanus! Thank you so much for this amazing mod, it has made Red Dead a much more enjoyable experience for me 🙂

Something I think would add to the enjoyment of this mod is adding a 'bleed out' timer for npcs with low health. As an example I had a few wounded on the ground twitching, it would be nice to see them pass away after a certain point, also for wounded npcs still standing, seeing them in cover shooting and then slumping over once their 'timer' runs out would be awesome.

I hope you are enjoying creating this mod as much as I am enjoying playing it, keep up the great work!

@k1ngj3w this is actually something I am currently working on (bleed out timer) 🙂

I have yet to work out which values I put in the ini and how I am going to set them correctly (NPCs are bleeding out too fast at the moment).

I am glad that you are enjoying this mod 🙂

@HughJanusWhoa! I found a new problem, but this is a MASSIVE improvement. You single-handedly fixed one of RDR2's most immersion-breaking features.

Here's the problem I found: it's quite possible that KnockbackThreshold and DyingThreshold cause functionally identical behaviour. The knockback behaviour is exactly the same as the dying behaviour. If I set KnockbackThreshold to 499 (with KnockbackChance to 100) and DyingThreshold to a very low value, a single shot will result in the enemy falling over into a dying behaviour and -- as far as I've seen -- never getting back up again. I did test it by shooting an NPC and seeing if they ever got back up, but minutes passed and they remained on the dying behaviour.

Inverting the parameters (DyingThreshold to 499, KnockbackThreshold to a low value) would cause the exact same thing to happen, the exact same behaviour (except this time they were congruent with the parameters).

If I understand the mod's description correctly, the Knockback is supposed to keep the NPC down for a certain amount of time, correct? It's the out-of-breath feature, so you shoot them, they fall, they get their breath back for a random amount of time, then they get back up in the fight, is that it?

If that's the idea, then it's not working that way. Knockback and Dying are functionally identical behaviours. I set both down to 0 to see if it could be something else, but when they're both set to 0, then NPCs simply behave like in the vanilla game. Only by setting either parameter to a high value would the Dying behaviour kick in.
 

Interestingly, KnockbackChance still has an effect over whether or not an enemy enters the Dying behaviour as set by KnockbackThreshold. So those values seem to be correctly interlinked but leading to the wrong behaviour.

Another problem, which was also present in 1.1 and I think 1.0 but I forgot to mention it, is that headshots seem to have some problematic hitboxes. Hitting near the outline of the NPC's head will not cause them to die. In some cases I've shot the side of their head dead-center and they didn't die, as if the bullet has to hit the actual face in order to kill instantly.

Finally, I tested the stumbling behaviour and it is unchanged. I'm mentioning this just in case you tweaked it, just so you know whether it changed anything.

That's about it. Congratulations and thank you, the mod is now a huge improvement over the vanilla game. There's some great interplay between features now: if you hit an artery shot when the enemy is already near the DyingThreshold, they'll go into the artery shot ragdoll behaviour and then straight into the dying behaviour, without getting back up and running away. It adds a lot of variety to gunfights.

 

@fitfondue In this script, almost all the stuff that happens is checked every millisecond. What the knockback chance does is resetting the ragdoll timer -> when you shoot an NPC for example in the leg, the game sets the NPC to ragdoll for a certain amount of time (vanilla behavior), what the mod does is it checks the NPC if it is under the knockback threshold - if so, if the randomizer (computes a number between 0 an 99) results in a number below the knockback chance (you set in the ini), the ragdoll timer is reset (= the NPC stays on the ground longer than vanilla intended). If you now set this chance to 100, the NPC will be knocked down infinitely. You will have to figure out a number which serves you well during gameplay (the number I came up with (13%) gave pretty good results for my taste).

The dying threshold doesnt have a randomizer applied. It just checks if the NPC is below the threshold and if so, sets the NPC to ragdoll automatically and then leaves it there indefinitely.

The "problem" with the head is that if you dont destroy the brain, the game wont kill the NPC instantly. If you shoot the head somewhere where you dont hit the brain, it "only" causes a lot of damage (which kills the NPC in vanilla, but not with this mod, since the health value is higher). I quite like that behavior, because in reality humans can also survive headshots if nothing major is damaged.

I didnt tweak anything concerning the stumbling (wouldnt know how to make it more polished). But you can grab the source code of this mod from this site and try around yourself (I commented everything, so you should be able to understand what I did quite quickly):